Poker players

ThePapi said:
Considered by who?
And why?

Just curious bro. I'd love to hear the explanation of how Sarkis played his 10-9 beautifully.
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The initial raise is weird but you can hear the announcer say "ANOTHER raise by the russian". Like he was doing it quite often at that time, probably with many other not raise-worthy hands...just mixing things up a bit maybe? The following call makes sense as explained above.

I don't see it as a bad beat.
 
its a loose opening bet by a loose player.

the 3bet all-in and then the hero call are 100% standard.



i wouldn`t be in this position because i wouldnt open the pot UTG with T9 offsuit.. BUT had I have been in this position, with the same chip stack situation and the table image of a crazy russian, i`m calling 100% there. and you should too.

the 3bet shove from the SB just screams any blackjack cards. it was written in the sky.


its also not a bad beat or a bad play because A) russian T9 is a 2 to 1 dog against bellande AQo. B) russian is getting more than 2.5 to 1 on money therefore thin-value profitable play


nothing special here, very standard
 
fromage said:
its a loose opening bet by a loose player.

i wouldn`t be in this position because i wouldnt open the pot UTG with T9 offsuit...
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That's where I draw the line. Anything that happens after that is superfluous to the fact that this guy is attacking a pot by raising 10-9 pretty much in the dark. That shit is insane. He might've been trying to steal the blinds on a tight table and got caught.

Crazy russian indeed, wouldn't call his play "standard" though.
 
ThePapi said:
That's where I draw the line. Anything that happens after that is superfluous to the fact that this guy is attacking a pot by raising 10-9 pretty much in the dark. That shit is insane. He might've been trying to steal the blinds on a tight table and got caught.

Crazy russian indeed, wouldn't call his play "standard" though.
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It is standard if you do raise t9 utg. He's pretty stacked so 4xbb raise pf can be profitable based on table dynamics.


He didn't get caught, he gambled and called a cheap 3bet shove. I'd have called with any connectors in that spot
 
fromage said:
It is standard if you do raise t9 utg. He's pretty stacked so 4xbb raise pf can be profitable based on table dynamics.


He didn't get caught, he gambled and called a cheap 3bet shove. I'd have called with any connectors in that spot
Click to expand...

X1000 with the rest of your points

Standard play
 
fromage said:
It is standard if you do raise t9 utg. He's pretty stacked so 4xbb raise pf can be profitable based on table dynamics.


He didn't get caught, he gambled and called a cheap 3bet shove. I'd have called with any connectors in that spot
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Fair enough. This thread makes me want to start playing again.
 
Do you guys recommend any books to learn Poker? I know the basic and all, but I would really like to read on the subject when I am on my way to school
 
ThePapi said:
Considered by who?
And why?

Just curious bro. I'd love to hear the explanation of how Sarkis played his 10-9 beautifully.
Click to expand...

By any pro . A bad beat is basically a hand u cannot lose with 99% of the time and then u get beat .

I while back I was watching poker after dark on a regular basis . The amount of times esfandiari plays shitty cards if u will , out of position is incredible . According to you those would all be bad beats .

I was also listening to an interview with Doyle Bronson . He was saying how poker is so much harder today because u can't get a read on people because so many new players are super loose and aggressive .

What's Daniel nagranu's favourite hand ? 4-5 or 5-6 suited ? He plays low to mid suited connectors all day long . So every hand he win with those cards is a bad beat ?

Some online poker sites pay you if you get bad beat , I guarantee you you won't get payed for that .
 
skylox said:
By any pro . A bad beat is basically a hand u cannot lose with 99% of the time and then u get beat .

I while back I was watching poker after dark on a regular basis . The amount of times esfandiari plays shitty cards if u will , out of position is incredible . According to you those would all be bad beats .

I was also listening to an interview with Doyle Bronson . He was saying how poker is so much harder today because u can't get a read on people because so many new players are super loose and aggressive .

What's Daniel nagranu's favourite hand ? 4-5 or 5-6 suited ? He plays low to mid suited connectors all day long . So every hand he win with those cards is a bad beat ?

Some online poker sites pay you if you get bad beat , I guarantee you you won't get payed for that .
Click to expand...


Your hand range varies between the games you play. A 10/9s early in a tourney isn't worth the same as a 10/9s in position in a 9 men cash game. You can't really watch PAD or any TV show as a legitimate source of poker schooling. They'll show you how durrr won a hand with 2-3os but they won't show the last couple times he did an easy flop fold with that same hand. You know ?

Guys like Doyle Bronson, Negreanu etc etc are TV pros who have been playing full time for countless of years. When they get in a hand with the worst cards they don't approach the hand like you or I would. You get in a hand and try to play like it these guys, most of the time you will loose and end up using excuses to justify your loss. Respecting the hand range is much more important for casual players like us. I've won so many home SNG games by playing less than 10 TAG hands in 2 hours and just letting all the aggros kill each others. Basic ABC sng poker when playing against live fishes.


Play a good 100-200 games of micro SNG online with that style of play and then bring the same approach to live home SNG games and it will feel like a walk in the park !

For books I higly recommend Jon turner's 2 tournament books, harrington on poker and also The mental game of poker. Alot of free strategies are available on 2+2 forums. I don't play cash games so I can't recommend anything...

here's a little fun page I like to show to my friends ( from The Mmental game of poker)

You may be a solid winning poker player who recognizes the shortcomings
of a bad player, but as far as the mental game is concerned, you
are likely no different. A solid player is a mental game fish if they:
1. Change a proven winning strategy because they are running bad/hot.
2. Never recognize when someone has played well against them and/
or believe everyone they play against is bad and just gets lucky.
3. Try to win every hand.
4. Think the outcome of a hand can be changed by shouting, praying,
or playing a favorite hand.
5. Get frustrated when a bad player plays badly and they even educate
them as to why they are bad.
6. Feel like a failure when they lose a hand that was played profitably.
7. Think the solution to running bad is to stop playing or change stakes.
8. Read a poker book cover to cover and think they know everything in it.
9. Watch some of Phil Galfond’s training videos and think they should
now be able to crush the game like him.
10. Believe that they are cursed or that other people are luckier than
they are.
11. Believe it’s possible to own another player’s soul.
12. Play more hands when they are winning/losing.
13. Play fewer hands when they are winning/losing.
T H E ME N T A L G A ME O F P O K E R
10
14. Play badly when the stakes are too small for them to care.
15. Allow things to get personal with another regular.
16. Tell bad beat stories to anyone that will listen, while doing nothing
to improve how they react to bad beats.
17. Say “one time.”
 
santacruz89 said:
Your hand range varies between the games you play. A 10/9s early in a tourney isn't worth the same as a 10/9s in position in a 9 men cash game. You can't really watch PAD or any TV show as a legitimate source of poker schooling. They'll show you how durrr won a hand with 2-3os but they won't show the last couple times he did an easy flop fold with that same hand. You know ?

Guys like Doyle Bronson, Negreanu etc etc are TV pros who have been playing full time for countless of years. When they get in a hand with the worst cards they don't approach the hand like you or I would. You get in a hand and try to play like it these guys, most of the time you will loose and end up using excuses to justify your loss. Respecting the hand range is much more important for casual players like us. I've won so many home SNG games by playing less than 10 TAG hands in 2 hours and just letting all the aggros kill each others. Basic ABC sng poker when playing against live fishes.


Play a good 100-200 games of micro SNG online with that style of play and then bring the same approach to live home SNG games and it will feel like a walk in the park !

For books I higly recommend Jon turner's 2 tournament books, harrington on poker and also The mental game of poker. Alot of free strategies are available on 2+2 forums. I don't play cash games so I can't recommend anything...

here's a little fun page I like to show to my friends ( from The Mmental game of poker)

You may be a solid winning poker player who recognizes the shortcomings
of a bad player, but as far as the mental game is concerned, you
are likely no different. A solid player is a mental game fish if they:
1. Change a proven winning strategy because they are running bad/hot.
2. Never recognize when someone has played well against them and/
or believe everyone they play against is bad and just gets lucky.
3. Try to win every hand.
4. Think the outcome of a hand can be changed by shouting, praying,
or playing a favorite hand.
5. Get frustrated when a bad player plays badly and they even educate
them as to why they are bad.
6. Feel like a failure when they lose a hand that was played profitably.
7. Think the solution to running bad is to stop playing or change stakes.
8. Read a poker book cover to cover and think they know everything in it.
9. Watch some of Phil Galfond’s training videos and think they should
now be able to crush the game like him.
10. Believe that they are cursed or that other people are luckier than
they are.
11. Believe it’s possible to own another player’s soul.
12. Play more hands when they are winning/losing.
13. Play fewer hands when they are winning/losing.
T H E ME N T A L G A ME O F P O K E R
10
14. Play badly when the stakes are too small for them to care.
15. Allow things to get personal with another regular.
16. Tell bad beat stories to anyone that will listen, while doing nothing
to improve how they react to bad beats.
17. Say “one time.”
Click to expand...

Thanks, you saved me a lot of typing.

Skylox I get your point nonetheless.
 
WannaBeDrifter said:
Do you guys recommend any books to learn Poker? I know the basic and all, but I would really like to read on the subject when I am on my way to school
Click to expand...

super system 1 and 2 by Doyle Brunson.


its the basics of poker essentially, it`ll show you the basic math behind poker pot odds vs odds to win, implied odds, etc., and what is a profitable move or not. it is incredibly obsolete because people have pretty much solved Texas Holdem, theres less of a gap between the average players and good players. you have to gamble a bit more nowadays.
 
WannaBeDrifter said:
Do you guys recommend any books to learn Poker? I know the basic and all, but I would really like to read on the subject when I am on my way to school
Click to expand...

The super systems are good, also Harrington on Poker is a good one. Another good idea is to check out the Sklansky groups and the correlation between the groups and the number of players at a table, or the correlation betweem the groups and which stage of a tournament you're in. It gives you a good general idea of what kind of hand to play when you open up your range in the mid to late stages of a tournament, or when playing against 4 players as opposed to 9 or 10 players.

Regarding the game being solved, I think it applies mostly to tournement, and especially single table Sit-n-gos.

You will find that Sit-n-go strategy varies only slightly from player to player, the basics being to open up your game as the initial donkey shootout is mostly over. If you want to see donkey shootouts, play a couple freerolls and keep an eye on the player count. On full tilt you can litterally fold your way to the money in some freerolls and start playing for real after the second break.

In the early stages, a lot of players are loose because the blinds are low, so you should remain tight and always lead the betting strongly if you decide to play a hand. As the game progresses, the players that got chips in the beginning will tighten up to protect their earnings and hope to coast to the money. That's a wide open door to change gears and start stealing pots and blinds.

In general you want to avoid going to a flop with more than 2-3 players behind you. Even that is scary to me.

Try to isolate people and go up head to head against them. If you slowplay AA pre-flop in hopes that more players join in and give you money, your AAs are losing value because it's a harder hand to improve than say 5 guys who limp in behind you with hands like 8-9 because it was so cheap and flop 10-7, needing any of 8 cards (4 jacks left in the deck or 4 sixes left in the deck) to get a straight against your AAs, who need another A to improve with only two left in the deck. You want to go against players who are looking to pair their K or Q because if they do pair them, they'll most likely think they're ahead and keep chipping in. These players will call a pre-flop raise, while the speculative 8-9 will most likely fold instead of paying a chunk of their stacks to go after a shitty pair that can only beat a bluff anyway.

You can dodge one or two open ended straight draws, but if you bring too many people with you on cheap flops, you will get your jimmies copiously rustled by shit cards more often than not on a later street. If a guy flops an open ended straight draw, he will be harder to shake off your tail on the turn or river, so imagine trying to get rid of 4 of them because you're scared your AAs will get cracked by a 6 high straight. This is especially true with bad players who will call your bets even if you crush their odds so keep 'em honest, and if you decide to play a hand, make 'em pay to see cards before they get a flop, and don't give free cards when you got them hooked. There are exceptions, but generally speaking this is for starters.

There's nothing wrong with bringing one or two dreamers with connectors to the flop and leading them on to nothing if they don't hit their straight, but don't do that with 6 players at the same time it's too risky.

I play low limits and 5$ sit-n-gos mostly, and this worked great in single table tournaments. I'm not a profitable cash game player though. It's been a few months since I've played but I always go back to poker every now and then.

It's a fucking great game, but it's not exactly easy.
 
^^^ I'm just saying , most people don't play the way it should be played therefore u end up with mofos calling you with shit cards , or people raising under the gun with crap and get lucky runner runner.

How often do you see a royal flush ? How often do you see quads or better yet ,quad aces . how often do you see quad aces and a royal flush in the same hand ?
 
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